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Green Bay Paddlers
WGA Member



Joined: 2003-10-12
Posts: 346
Location: Green Bay, WI

PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 9:29 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'm just curious to see if the WGA has a definition of a "vacation cache." The reason I ask is because I know a couple great places about 2-3 hours from my house (all in Wisconsin) where I would love to place caches.

While I do "vacation" at these places I'm not sure that they would fall under the definition of "vacation caches" as I would be able to drive to them most weekends should a problem arise and I need to retreive them.

Thoughts?

Jeff
 
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Cathunter




Joined: 2003-09-10
Posts: 1263
Location: Bristol WI

PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 11:17 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'm just another cacher, but I believe one should not place a cache if they would not take care of it within a 48 hour notice of a problem. It seems to me there are already way too many caches out there needing maintenance or archived due to lack thereof.

A better idea might be to get to know one or more of the local cachers, and ask them to adopt a cache for you.
 
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kbraband
WGA Historian



Joined: 2002-02-19
Posts: 2461
Location: Mequon, WI US

PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 11:38 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with placing a cache 2 to 3 hours from home if you can and would get there within a week to check or maintain a cache. I believe the crackdown on "vacation" caches came about because some people were placing caches while on cruises or during visits to foreign countries.
 
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wzbt03
WGA Friend



Joined: 2003-02-02
Posts: 736
Location: Janesville, Wisconsin

PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 6:34 am Reply with quote Back to top

I think one of the many reasons of a cache is to bring people to a particular area that you would like them to see. Some states even allow out of staters to place caches as long as they can be maintained. I know that Lil Otter has some out of state - one of which "Wayward Home" in Illinois is one of the best caches in the area. Kbraband has some in Iowa and on the Mississippi that I would love to do yet. I think there are enough cachers out there that most, if not all, would help maintain it as they visit the area.
One of my peeves about geocaching is the "vacation cache". When in Jamaica last spring I found there were only 4 caches in the whole country. I hid one on Booby Cay (a small deserted island off Negril) and even had a local available if the need arose. It was turned down under the vacation cache rule. You would have to convince me that there was any harm done with this one. I offered to change it to a virtual with multi-stages and was again rebuffed. Not to tough to maintain a virtual.
On the other hand - hide one in China and get caught and you will spend the rest of your days in prison according to someone who has cached there.
Stage one of the cache could be, go to cell 11 and get coordinates scratched on the wall.....

On a more serious side, those of us who have caches far away from their homes depend on others to help. If you get some no finds - either get out and investigate it or disable/archive it. Not much different then one 1 mile from your house that gets lost - you would do the same thing.
 
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Green Bay Paddlers
WGA Member



Joined: 2003-10-12
Posts: 346
Location: Green Bay, WI

PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 9:29 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The more I look at these postings - the more I agree. I think the 48 hour rule is a stretch - even for a cache in the backyard. There are weekends out of town, busy work schedules, etc... The nice thing is that we are teachers. Yeah, we put in 10-12 hour days 9 months of the year but we have 3 months of summer completely off to maintain caches. I would even volunteer to maintain other caches in the area.

Good stuff - keep the discussion going!!!!
 
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GrouseTales
WGA Member



Joined: 2002-02-18
Posts: 3399
Location: West Allis, Wi

PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 8:19 am Reply with quote Back to top

When I'm approving caches, I usually check the profile of the owner to see where they live, and the areas they visit. If the cache owner is from out of state, or if they said "we placed the cache while on vacation", these are automatic red flags. In these cases I would contact the cache owner and see how they plan to maintain the cache.

If you are from Wisconsin and you place a cache somewhere in Wisconsin, I'm not too concerned. I would expect someone to be able to maintain a cache within a months time if needed.

The nice thing about our great WGA site, we are able to post messages and ask others for help. Say I have a cache in the opposite part of the state and a problem arises, I can ask someone to check on it or repair it until I can get there myself.

If someone places a cache while on vacation and we DON'T approve it, then it becomes geo-trash. No one will pick it up unless the cache owner returns to get it. It may sit there and rot in the woods forever. This is one good arguement against placing caches that you can't maintain.

In the past we have had some caches that were placed while on vacation, and couldn't be approved because they were in violation of one rule or another. Several of these were in State Natural Areas (SNA), which we all Should know are off limits. Luckily we were able to arrange a rescue with a volunteer to move the cache to an acceptable area.

Cachers should still maintain their caches over the internet by reading the logs and posting notes where applicable. You may even want to temporarily disable the cache if it looks like there is a problem. That may buy you some time until you can physically check the cache.

WGA Admin - Brian


------------------
"There are two kinds of hunting: ordinary hunting and grouse hunting."
-Aldo Leopold, A sand county Almanac


Brian
WGA Vice President
Grousetales@wi-geocaching.com
 
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Cathunter




Joined: 2003-09-10
Posts: 1263
Location: Bristol WI

PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 5:16 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Obviously, my thinking is more on the extreme side. My thinking is that if I am driving up north for a few, and find a major problem with a cache
Quote:
the coords point into the river and the cache description and hint don't match the coords & the cache is unfound in a 200' search area
I would think it a common courtesy that the cache owner be able to fix the problem within a few days. Thus, on my return trip, I can swing by and make the find.

Again, my way of caching may not be as relaxed as others, but I don't think anyone should have to wait weeks after already driving many miles- for a cache problem to be fixed. I and many others have added logbooks, pens, zip-locks, etc. to keep caches going; I would hope that every cache owner cares as much about the cache as I do.

How many times should a cache owner be allowed to ignore a trashed cache without as much as checking on it or archiving it?. How many no-finds, spread over weeks, should a cache remain unarchived if the cache owner doesn't even bother to post a note on the cache page regarding the problem?

Don't get me wrong, this isn't negativity I’m projecting- it's enthusiasm! Let's everybody take care of their caches & get some fulfilling & enjoyable finds out there!



[This message has been edited by Cathunter (edited 11-25-2003).]
 
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wzbt03
WGA Friend



Joined: 2003-02-02
Posts: 736
Location: Janesville, Wisconsin

PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 6:15 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The subject matter has strayed a bit but as a general rule:

If I cannot find the cache on the first try, I will usually wait to see if someone else logs a find. If they do I just go back again with a much humbler look on my face.

If I am sure after searching that something is wrong, I will email the cache owner and let them know the issue. This has happened with more then one of my caches and it has been very helpful. Sometimes I will leave a no find log to tip others off if I think something may be amiss.

If I cannot find a cache after looking twice and others have found it - I plead for help <S>.

The best ones are like "Wayward Home" by Lil Otter - myself and another couple geocachers could not find it and figured something was wrong and wrote her and logged the no find. Then I found out how clever that Lil Otter is and ate cold crow.

Sometimes it is just gone and in these cases the no finds logged will tell the story.

So keep a smile on your face, life in your step and patience in your heart. The next cache is only a hunt away.
 
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Cathunter




Joined: 2003-09-10
Posts: 1263
Location: Bristol WI

PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 7:57 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I agree with you fully, although I am careful about logging "no finds". The problem with logging a "no find" is that it scares off the newbies, who then won't hunt it, when in fact it could have just been my eyesight. Image If there is 2 or 3 no-finds, I will usually question the owner only to find that the cache has not been checked on in many months, if they even bother to respond. If the owner verifies in the log that all is well, then I will be more likely to log a "no find".
 
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kbraband
WGA Historian



Joined: 2002-02-19
Posts: 2461
Location: Mequon, WI US

PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:34 pm Reply with quote Back to top

quote:
Originally posted by Cathunter:
I agree with you fully, although I am careful about logging "no finds". The problem with logging a "no find" is that it scares off the newbies, who then won't hunt it, when in fact it could have just been my eyesight.


I gotta respectfully disagree about posting no finds. I think everyone should post them whenever they can't find a cache. Everyone, including the cache owner, deserves to know if someone looked and did not find -- for whatever reason. It's a courtesy to all other cachers.
 
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sbukosky
WGA Member



Joined: 2002-02-18
Posts: 644
Location: Waukesha, WI USA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2003 5:45 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I agree with Ken. Please post your no finds unless you made a half hearted search. If the cache owner verifies that the cache is there and the coordinates are within reason, then the difficulty level might need to be adjusted. I believe ''newbies'' should go on the easier caches to begin with rather than possibly get frustrated with too many no finds and give up on the hobby.

Also, I personally believe that a useful hint should be given to enable a hunter to find the cache. With few exceptions, my philosophy is the cache is just a reason to make the journey.
 
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