This topic contains 26 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by 
kbraband 23 years, 1 month ago.
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If you made it into this forum, that means you’re involved in giving input on our draft for a geocaching policy for the state parks. Welcome, and thanks for your help.
In case you misplaced the printed copy we handed out at the picnic, the text is below. Please submit your comments by the end of this week so we can keep this moving.
(Please see updated draft below)[This message has been edited by kbraband (edited 10-01-2002).]
I just noticed we had a minor conflict with points 3.4 and 3.5. I have now deleted point 3.5 from the draft. It was no longer necessary because of an earlier change we made to 3.4.
3.3 A cache may remain at the approved site for no more than five years at which time it must be removed and the Park Manager informed of the removal. This will control cache abandonment and assist in preventing volunteer trail development to the site.
Five years of caching on one spot would really make a volunteer trail likely.. but let’s see if they catch that (grins)..
And as far as prior caches.. I say that there should be a line in stating that older caches be grandfathered in.. as long as they are not in a sensitive area.. perhaps some volunteers can fill out the forms as to the lon/lats so that the rangers can place them in the files and forget about them (grins).. hate to lose ones like those at Gov Dodge..
~The Lil Otter
Item 4.2, which reads:
4.2 If a geocache hunter finds inappropriate items in a cache (such as food, drugs, alcohol, hazardous materials, knives and other weapons, etc.) he or she shall remove these items from the cache.
There may be a slight issue with this item. Should somebody come accross illegal drugs in a cache, I don’t know that the proper action would be to remove them. Obviously, they can’t be there, BUT, from a legal standpoint, I think that if you remove the drugs, you are now in POSSESION of a controlled susbstance. In the unlikely event an officer catches you, I think you’d be in trouble.
I have never found any drugs in a cache, but it could happen. I just don’t think it is wise to take possession of the drugs from a legal standpoint.
quote:
Originally posted by Thraxman:
Item 4.2, which reads:4.2 If a geocache hunter finds inappropriate items in a cache (such as food, drugs, alcohol, hazardous materials, knives and other weapons, etc.) he or she shall remove these items from the cache.
There may be a slight issue with this item. Should somebody come accross illegal drugs in a cache, I don’t know that the proper action would be to remove them. Obviously, they can’t be there, BUT, from a legal standpoint, I think that if you remove the drugs, you are now in POSSESION of a controlled susbstance. In the unlikely event an officer catches you, I think you’d be in trouble.
I have never found any drugs in a cache, but it could happen. I just don’t think it is wise to take possession of the drugs from a legal standpoint.
This is a good point. We once found a large kitchen knife near a cache. We called the local police and an officer came out to investigate. That would also be the correct procedure, especially for more serious items such as guns or drugs.
A handgun was found in the woods by our Entwive’s Tumor cache. The cacher called the police who came and took possesion of it. That works…
I added a sentence in 3.1 (see the revised text above) stating that local law enforcement officials should be notified if illegal drugs or weapons are found in or near a cache.
Still reading this over again.
2.1 “…Parks requires permission…”
Should “written and/or emailed” be put in, so each cacher would have a copy of his/her permission?
2.2 “…large lettering with the word Geocache on the outside…”
What about micros and other smaller caches and those with camoflage tape, etc?
quote:
Originally posted by hotdogs_off_trail:
Still reading this over again.2.1 “…Parks requires permission…”
Should “written and/or emailed” be put in, so each cacher would have a copy of his/her permission?
2.2 “…large lettering with the word Geocache on the outside…”
What about micros and other smaller caches and those with camoflage tape, etc?
2.1 We’re trying to avoid a written application scenario. The DNR may eventually stipulate that, but we don’t want to be the ones to propose it. If we mention written permission that may lead to some sort of application form. At least that’s been our reasoning to date. Please say so if you strongly disagree.
2.2 Micros can still have Geocache written on them. In the case of a film container “large lettering” would be relative. If a container is wrapped in camo cloth, that’s fine. Using camo cloth is just like putting sticks or rocks on a cache to conceal it, so you wouldn’t need to have “geocache” written on the cloth. However, if it’s camo tape affixed directly to the container, you should have “geocache” written on the outside of the container. I don’t think we’ll need to get that specific in the policy. Those are just my interpretations of what the draft policy now means.
Thanks for your comments. Keep ’em coming.
[This message has been edited by kbraband (edited 08-27-2002).]
quote:
Originally posted by Trudy & the beast:
I believe it would be preferable to obtain permission before the cache is actually put into place. I have made the necessary changes suggested in brackets below.Actually. Item 2.1.1 already indicates that the cache placer should obtain permission before placing the cache:
2.1.1 Step 1. Before you place a cache, contact the park manager to obtain permission to place a cache in that park. This can either be done in person, in writing, by email, or by telephone.
When I worked with Ranger Dave on my Rochi-A-Cri cache container.. I found it better to bring to him several locations that I’d enjoy hiding it at.. I had those locations marked on their park map with lon/lats. By getting his okay on the placement prior to setting it there just seemed to be less of “she’s telling me where” but of him agreeing with me that the place(s) were well suited for such a hide. It would seem to give them more control over what’s going on instead of a cacher coming in out of the blue and INFORMING them that they already hid a cache and acting like it was their right.. (I hope I made sense in explaining it’s been a tough day)..
~The Lil OtterI agree that we need to empower the ranger. I feel that it would be a benefit to have a statement from the state that approves of general caching in their parks, and that the local ranger can be helpful in our search to protcet certain areas that they don’t want people to be in.
As its been a couple of weeks without further comment, I was wondering what state the draft is in, and if there was a tentative date to deliver it to the DNR for consideration.
A couple comments and suggestions about the draft:
1. It may be beneficial to include a definition of what a Geocache is. I know there are thousands of variations of a Geocache, some type of definition may prevent
problems in the future. Somewhere in the definition we should include that a Geocache is NOT abandoned property. I’m not sure exactly how we would word it. Most laws and regulations have a defination of the activity they are governing. Example are boating regulations define a boat, motorboat, pwc. Hunting regulations define what a firearm is, etc.
Here are some of my thoughts:
A “Geocache” is any container, marker, or item that is hidden by a person and whose location is published for other people to find. The intent of a Geocache is often to bring a the cache seeker to a scenic park, interesting place, and to provide a quality outdoor experience. Geocaches are intentionally placed by a person and are NOT abandoned property. Geocache containers take many different shapes and sizes. Most containers serve the purpose of providing a weather resistant place to store small items and/or notebooks. Typical containers are metal ammo boxes, “Tupperware” type containers, and/or other waterproof boxes. A “Microcache” is a small container, generally the size of a film container. A “virtual” cache brings a searcher to a preexisting object at the specified coordinates, such as a sign or monument. There is no actually container placed at a “virtual” Geocache. A “Muliticache” is a series of tags, markers, or caches that a person must find in order to find the final Geocache container.I’m sure we could word the above better, but without a definition, a park ranger may only accept one type of container as “Geocache.” By including the statement that this is NOT abandoned property, it may prevent the DNR from actually claiming that a cache is litter and citing a person for same. By getting to accept this statement up front, it may help us out in the long run.
2. I also had some problems with the wording of section 3.1 Illegal Drugs and weapons. Perhaps we could switch it to word “illegal Weapons or drugs.” I would
not want the DNR to be notified every time a little pocket knife is left in the cache. This type of attention may look bad for Geocaching in the parks. If the DNR keeps getting notified about knifes being placed in a cache, how long do you think they will allow caching? If we say “Illegal weapons or drugs,” it makes it sound more like firearms and such. I agree with the statements that if illegal firearms or drugs are found in or near a cache, the authorities should be notified.3. In section 3.2, how about we make it 500 feet? We could word it that if you move it beyond 500 feet, you need to seek permission to move it. If moved inside of a 500 ft radius, you should update the park manager with it’s current location, but new permission is not needed. Prior approval to move a cache within 500 is not necessary?
4. The WGA now has the Administrative authority to archive caches. I suggest we
word the policy to include us. In other words, if the DNR has a problem with a cache
or needs helping archiving the cache or notifying the cache owner, the DNR may
contact the WGA to request assistance.5. We still have the lingering issues of after hour/out of season notifications, and
preexisting caches. There should probably be a grace period for cachers to
notify park personal of a preexisting cache. The cache owner should contact the park manager advising it’s existence and location. If the park has a problem with the cache, they can work it out with the cache placer.
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