It’s all relative

[BeccaDay]

Hello WGA cachers, I’m ba-ack! We got home from our trip out west yesterday and today I started plugging away at logging all of our caches, a momentous task! This may take me a week to type up all the answers to the EC’s and VC’s that we did, especially in Yellowstone. ANYWAY, as I am logging these and thinking back over what it took to obtain these caches it has struck me how one person’s interpretation of a difficulty or terrain rating is certainly different than another. I’d say that we in the midwest are pretty generous out here with our terrain ratings after doing more mountain caching. The one that struck me the most is GCG8XY Be Inspired. It’s a virtual because it’s in a National Park but what an amazing find, I’m glad I got to do this one. So the first 2 miles or so of the terrain on the hike I’d rate a 3 because it’s a dirt trail with tons of tree roots and rocks. The kind that is well-marked but you have to keep your eyes on your boots the whole way. Then there’s a section on some wooden stairs so that isn’t too hard. Then the last, I don’t remember, maybe .5 to .75 miles it is a very steep ascent up a rocky path that clings to the side of the mountain. There are big drop-offs with no barrier on the side, the path is very uneven, switchbacks, rock interspersed with very loose dirt which is easy to slip on, and the path is only 3ish feet wide. I loved it! Anyway, so as I am doing this hike I’m trying to remember what the terrain rating is, assuming that it’s 4 or 4.5. I knew it wouldn’t be a 5 since there’s no special equipment needed. So I go to log it and note that it’s only a 3.5 for terrain! It made me laugh a little at some of the 3.5’s I’ve seen around here, they must think we’re such wimps! So I just thought I’d share my story and wonder what you all think about inconsistency in terrain and/or difficulty ratings. ❓

Not all who wander are lost. -J.R.R. Tolkien

[EricKrista]

With a 1 being wheel chair accessible and a 5 needing special equipment …. there is a lot of latitude for accessibility range. I placed a cache myself that I needed to grope tree’s to access, but someone pointed out to me that by taking a different route … its way easier… How do you rate that? 😆

[Trekkin and Birdin]

Becca, I know what you mean. I did an excellent cache in Killarney Provincial Park in Ontario this past May that sounds much like what you describe. The last .25 was straight up over rock piles, basically. I think it was rated a 3. It was at least a 2.5 mile hike one way.

I didn’t do it for the ratings, though. It is in my top five favorites. I don’t think I stopped smiling the whole time (which was about half the day!)

[zuma]

We may be wimps in Wisconsin, but at least we are not as wimpy as the folks in Iowa. Take a look at the upcoming events in Iowa. A bunch of them are Terrain 5 and some are 3.5, or 4.0.

I guess the whole D/T rating system is kind of meaningless if people are not expected to stay within the guidelines, at least some.

zuma

[BeccaDay]

I will have to check it out. I guess it’s just a matter of perspective. 🙂 One thing I will definately say about Wisconsin, I have heard that we have better quality series and challenges around here. My Mom is constantly telling me she’s jealous of the cool things I’ve been doing geocaching around here because they just don’t have things like that in CO. Also, we’re definately tougher cachers regarding weather. I believe out there it’s pretty common to shut down all caching activity in the winter. But here? Eh, what’s a little snow?!

Not all who wander are lost. -J.R.R. Tolkien

[Team Deejay]

Actually there really are no “guidelines” for terrain (or difficulty) ratings. I really, really wish there were (as a player), but as a reviewer, I have no idea how we could actually enforce such guidelines. I suppose, back in the day, reviewers could be expected to visit most of the caches they had approved, but obviously this is no longer possible.

[labrat_wr]

wasn’t there a D/T calculator somewhere once?
a tool to assist you in estimating a proper rating by answering a few questions about the placement?

Disclaimer : Always answering to a higher power.

[labrat_wr]

Ha! found it. linked below the D/T settings on the cache submission page.

http://www.geocaching.com/hide/rate.aspx

Disclaimer : Always answering to a higher power.

[uws22]

it definitely varies from each of the regions across the US. I started caching in AZ, so I can definitely tell you what a 4 terrain looks like. I have a cache still active in AZ that’s only been found 4 times in about 3 years due mostly to the terrain. There are some down there even tougher to get to than mine. Imagine my thoughts when I see some rated as 4 when I get to WI and they only take 20 minutes to get to.

At the same time however, if you haven’t been exposed to 3,000 foot climbs, certain terrain here in the state may seem like a 4 compared to everything else around. That’s the case with a few caches outside of Madison anyway.

[CodeJunkie]

I agree it’s definately relative. I have a good friend from New Jersey that says the same thing about T ratings here. I’m actually a fan of the “relative” rating though. I think if you base the terrain in comparison to a 100 mile or so radius that’s pretty fair for most cachers. And it’s not all about the numbers, grids, etc. for me either. I’d like to see what a full time AZ cacher thinks of the terrain here in the dead of winter when you have to use snow shoes, it’s below 0 (without windchill) and then you wade through a stream in hipboots to get to a cache buried under the snow. Or maybe a swamp with 8-10′ cattails in the heat of summer. Obviously these are all factors that affect the “terrain” rating and it’s just a gauge to indicate easy vs hard.

[sandlanders]

Those conditions qualify for a “CJ” rating. 😉

Becca, we’re headed out that way next month. It will be interesting to see your logs come in on these to help us narrow down some of our caching choices. We enjoyed all the ECs and virtuals we did to and from and at the Grand Canyon last year. I made our choices mostly by reading the whole cache page, not the D/T ratings. We’re T wimps both in Wisconsin and on our travels. 🙄

Looking forward to any pics you put up, too.

[BeccaDay]

OK Sandlanders, I got them all logged FINALLY last night. It’s kind of funny, I now have only 3 less EarthCaches found in Wyoming than I do in Wisconsin! Not bad for 8 days in the state in the past year. I also bought a new camera right before our trip so I took tons of pictures and uploaded quite a few. And if you need any suggestions just let me know. 🙂

Not all who wander are lost. -J.R.R. Tolkien

[Team Deejay]

I posted this to the reviewer forums, and I will repost it here. It is unfortunate that Groundspeak has chosen to NOT make the terrain ratings specifically defined or part of the guidelines. Here is what the terrain rating mean to me (which seems to basically match up with Clayjar’s old program)

1 = Handicapped accessible to get to the cache site (not necessarily to retrieve it), paved, flat, no obstructions, less than 1/2 mile of “foot” travel…parking lots, paved bike trails, sidewalks (and yes, I think the Handicaching system is far superior, but we can only do what we can do…)

1.5 = crushed limestone trails, lawns, packed gravel trails, less than 1 mile from parking, no major obstructions or elevation changes

2 = regular trails (dirt) to within a few feet of the cache, less than 2 miles from parking, obstructions and elevation changes are completely ok here

2.5 = like 2, but with a bit of bushwacking/rock hopping/desert crossing near the cache

3 = rough trails, lots of obstructions, significant bushwacking/rock hopping/desert crossing, trails can be any distance

3.5 = like 3, but with major bushwacking/rock hopping/desert crossing, minor bouldering/rock climbing/tree climbing involved, generally climbs will be less than 10 feet off the ground

4 = like 3 but with significant bouldering/rock climbing/tree climbing/wading/swimming. Climbs might reach 30 feet.

4.5 = like 3 but with major amounts of bouldering, rock climbing (free only), tree climbing, wading or swimming. Generally a 4.5 cache will indicate some level of danger to life and limb.

5 = Boats, SCUBA, Climbing gear, or other special equipment. Again, deep water/high climbs will imply a level of danger with finding cache in this terrain rating.

Of course, this is just my opinion, but I just wish there was some sort of universal guidance for people to use.

[Trekkin and Birdin]

Dave, What’s interesting in that rating system is the fact that “less than two miles’ from parking is rated a 2. I’d agree with that as well, if the terrain is otherwise easy movement. Yet, I’ve had complaints from people on something that ends up being a little over a half mile on flat terrain. We rated that a 2. Like becca said….all relative, I guess.

What I’d be curious to know is the different perceptions based on length of time geocaching. Since it has become a game of “get lots” more and more, the half mile hike seems like a waste of time for some. I wonder if “long timers,” like Hot Dogs, would think differently about these ratings.

Though I will confess that yesterday, while caching around Milton between dulcimer workshops, I did dump a half mile hike. We hardly ever do, but it was hot and I wanted to stay sort of fresh for when I went back to the concert in the evening. My travels yesterday were more about music and less about caching. Horrors, I know! 🙄

[BeccaDay]

Thanks Team Deejay, I think that is a great way to rank them. I appreciate it. 🙂

Not all who wander are lost. -J.R.R. Tolkien

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