new cachers

[kc9gbo]

Excellent post PcFrog! I totally agree with you on keeping up the quaulity of caches in your area. Your post is exactly what I was thinking of and couldn’t come up with a way to say it. I’ve posted NM logs when needed, and dnf’ed when I feel it is warranted to let others know that there is activity on the cache or that someone else is blind also.
I’ve seen your NM/SA on a few area caches that have been hanging around for some reason and never get taken care of, I think you are doing a favor for your area. To me, quality caches should be more important than having tons of caches that aren’t being maintained or are hidden to the point that people can’t find them just to see DNF’s roll in.

[zuma]

@PCFrog wrote:

Only speaking for myself…

I log DNF when I give an effort to find a cache. We all know why it is good thing to do this.

I will also log a NM if the cache does. As mentioned earlier, specific tags in identifying what NM are not part of the dropdown. Because of this, I will make a remark in the post as to why I marked it as NM. However, there is 1 exception to this. If I notice that a cache in my general cache area (20-30 mile radius) has received multiple DNFs over a period of time and the owner has failed to make a personal effort to check the cache and leave a post stating they have checked it, I then will leave a NM to better grab the attention of the owner and also let reviewer know there is an issue. When I say over period of time we are talking usually 3 months or more of DNF logs. Beat me up if you want, it is the owners responsibility to upkeep their own caches (I read this somewhere). Part of upkeep is paying attention to logs and checking out the cache at times. I have 1 hard cache and I make sure that I check it after a few DNFs and post a note that I did check it.

I’m not the cache police but I’m part of the cache community and it is the responsibility of the community to ensure that their cache area is not saturated with caches that have a majority of DNF and NM logs. It makes geocaching look bad and for prospective city officials to probably shun it. A few weeks ago I was gave a presentation to the Sparta Chamber of Commerce and imagine how it might look if the caches in the surrounding area were littered with DNF and NM logs. Poorly maintained caches can affect more than just the cacher looking for it

I don’t know why your caches are getting NM but if there were multiple DNF and YOU failed to check the cache yourself and leave a posted note then some cachers might feel that you have neglected your duties. Before you bash all new people, decided if you’re doing your part. If you are, then complain away.

YOU – refers to anyone who this might applies to and those who wish it to apply to them but most certainly not those who do not think it applies to.

Thanks PC, as I agree with your points. Especially your point that for geocaching to prosper we all need to do what we can to foster community. Community means to act in the best interests of all those in the community. While the community includes the cache owner, the cache owner is just one member of the community, so all decisions on whether to post an SBA or NM should be made while considering what is best for the community of other cachers.

If the cache needs maintenance, post a NM. If the cache owner is AWOL, post a SBA if the cache is gone or wrecked. If the cache owner is someone who is active and maintains their caches, then just send them an email, and let them take care of it. If you cannot find the cache, dont assume it is missing, and just post a DNF. Really, just practice the Golden Rule, and it should not be that much of an issue.

zuma

[The Happy Hodag!]

Personally, I’ve only posted a NM log once, and that was because I knew the cache was gone. It was one I had found before, and I was making a return trip to drop a Geocoin. I went directly to the final – nope, gone. I went to WP1 – nope, gone. So I just went back home to double check the online logs, and saw nothing by the owner, who at that point actually hadn’t logged in for several days and I hit the NM option.

-The Happy Hodag!

The buck stops here. . .and gets entered into Where's George.

Where's George? Stimulating the economy one EMS'ed dollar at a time.

[seldom|seen]

@zuma wrote:

Really, just practice the Golden Rule, and it should not be that much of an issue.

zuma

Short and sweet. Get to know the cacher MO and you get to know the quality of hides and how to proceed when you feel there is something worth bringing up. If you spot a problem, FIRST, see if YOU can fix it on the spot. Carry a few spare log sheets and small containers. If you can’t do anything about the issue, take a look at the owner’s profile, number of hides, number of disabled caches before you log your visit and then decide which way to go; DNF, NM or SBA.

And, for the sake of all of us, stuff a few extra baggies and logsheets in your pocket the next time you go out. There’s nothing more frustrating than a NM log on a perfectly good cache that just has a slightly damp or a full log sheet which could be remedied quicker than it takes to figure out what kind of NM log to post!

[Trekkin and Birdin]

I’d like to add one more aspect to this whole NM issue. We have never posted a NM in over 5600 finds, but instead have contacted owners via email if we couldn’t help out with the problem. In most cases, folks aren’t willfully leaving trashy caches out there. Often, it goes back to people never logging DNFs so that the owner knows there’s a problem. A DNF can work as a “pre” NM log, in a way.

Sometimes…..even when we write, nothing happens. I do like to err on the side of caution, because we ourselves have had times in our lives….we’re in that mode right now, in fact….where the condition of one of our caches is the least of our concerns. Yes, I’m home posting right now. Yes, Trekkin’ is off with friends racking up caches for the weekend. It’s called….one of us gets therapy, one holds down the fort.

Please keep in mind before going off on someone’s cache that maybe they have something else going on in their world that makes this whole world of geocaching seem rather trivial. I have seen a good number of NM logs that are really downright rude, and may not be what a person wants to open when they get around to checking their email.

[gotta run]

@Trekkin’ and Birdin’ wrote:

Please keep in mind before going off on someone’s cache that maybe they have something else going on in their world that makes this whole world of geocaching seem rather trivial. I have seen a good number of NM logs that are really downright rude, and may not be what a person wants to open when they get around to checking their email.

Well said indeed…

On the Left Side of the Road...

[BakRdz]

As a relative newbie, thought I’d chime in.

I have only put out a NM in 3 cases.
1 – The LOG was completely gone and I didn’t think I was allowed to replace it even if I had a log with me. I’ve since learned and now I travel with them and bags.
2 – The CACHE was gone, but found a log in a bag shoved in the hiding spot. Didn’t have a “spare cache.”
3 – Everything was gone. I knew it was gone. Others who found it before confirmed that it was gone. (…and because I was a VERY new newbie with only 40 finds at the time, I got a nasty email from the owner about how I shouldn’t have posted a NM. I tried to explain how I knew it was not there, but still don’t think he believed me. Took almost 2 more months of DNF’s for someone to finally archive it.)

In most cases if I’ve given it a good hunt and I’m relatively confident the cache is gone, I’ll still DNF it and explain that while I’m pretty sure I looked high and low in the right spot (especially for ** or under), it’s very likely that I may have missed it or my GPSr was sending me to the wrong spot. This way, the next person visiting (and the owner) at least has some notice it MIGHT be gone. Now that I’m getting to know more cachers, I sometimes contact one who has found it to confirm whether it’s missing – but that goes beyond the Newbie training.

@The Crippler wrote:

“Also, whats with the people who move your caches to spots where THEY think GZ is? “

And Crippler… TOTALLY agree with the moving a cache thing! I was raised by my momma to put things back where and HOW I found it. I have a cache that when placed into a split branch correctly, looks just like the branch. A geo-friend recently visited that cache and found it SIDEWAYS in the branch just waiting for some muggle to come along. He said he spotted it a mile away, but when he turned it the right way…MAGIC, it was nearly invisible! Did the person who jammed it in sideways just FORGET how it they found it in the few seconds it takes to open it and sign the log?!

[Author]

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