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@Mister Greenthumb wrote:
Also the remaining standing stone framework of the old hotel nearby is worth the visit.
Then be sure to check out GC1ZVZW.
It is only .1 mile as the crow flies from the nearest EarthCache, but you have to leave the park to avoid crossing the hotel grounds, which are private, albeit frequently trespassed.
On the Left Side of the Road...@marc_54140 wrote:
So, you can make your point here, but do not expect anyone to change his or her mind to agree with you.
I guess what has surprised me the most is not the lack of agreement on the topic (otherwise there wouldn’t be a need to discuss it), but the lack of understanding of an opposing point of view. I do understand the appeal of logging puzzle caches by any means possible; after all, our team keeps track of our numbers too. Stats are part of this game.
On the other hand, there is an incredulity on the other side that this issue would even bother anyone. If we are bothered by it, we are essentially told to quit placing caches.
We (the geocaching community) frown on posting spoilers in logs. In the puzzle forums here, we state “Note that this forum should not be used to post dead giveaways or spoilers for any puzzle cache.” Yet it is OK to hand a bus full of people a spreasheet of puzzle coordinates? Yes, I am making an assumption here, having not gone on a tour, but it is a reasonable assumption based on reading many logs, talking to people, and seeing the posted details for tours. Maybe I am wrong and everyone on that bus will come with some good-faith effort at solving the puzzles.
It’s also somewhat ironic that we (again, the geocaching community) will generally adhere to some wishes of owners, such as abstaining from hunting a tribute cache until the tributee has a shot at the FTF, unless and until the CO says it’s OK. But CO’s wishes on puzzle caches? Not so much I guess.
So, the “horse to water” analogy doesn’t quite work. On the “not OK” side, all we can do is stand at the river bank and plead with the horse to please come over because the water is really nice. On the other side, you can pour water down the horse’s throat, just don’t be baffled by the fact that he doesn’t like it.
On the Left Side of the Road...I see no reason to censor the debate on this topic even if it is passionate on either side. In the OT thread we have a whole topic with over 1,400 pages of drivel and over 21,000 replies and that horse is still kicking. There’s always the option to stop watching this topic or just stop clicking on the link.
I started this poll because I truly wanted to take a temperature reading of the Wisconsin geo-community. If anyone believes I had some other nefarious purpose I can’t change your mind. The reason I did it as a poll rather than simply a forum posting was that I many people will “comment” by way of a poll response, when they will not comment in a public forum, particularly when the discussion becomes heated.
I’m not sure how representative the voting responses are of the community. It seems like the responses have pretty much stopped or at least slowed to a trickle, and it’s pretty well split–probably weighted more heavily to the “It’s OK” side if you consider that some of the “Other” responses equate to “It’s OK sometimes” according to the reasons stated by some of the “Other” voters.
It does seem like a small sample but I haven’t compared it yet against other polls. Of course, it means nothing in the grand scheme of things because, as has been pointed out, a smilely is a smilely. But I have found, and continue to find, the posted comments useful–even the contentious ones. Overall this thread has confirmed some things I had thought, overturned my thinking on some other issues, and will shape the way I handle our puzzle caches going forward.
On the Left Side of the Road...Just one more quick note…
Mom and sister just got home from camp and the first thing Obi-Will said was “We went geocaching and we snowshoed 5 miles in the woods and I got poked with a stick in the eye and it was the funnest day of my life!”
So, I guess it gets his vote too.
On the Left Side of the Road...There’s a lot of watchers on this cache so the fact that we did this cache yesterday is probably known by many but I thought I would add to this thread as well.
Tactically, we decided to approach from the area Rsplash recommended in this thread on Yellow Birch, which was also the recommendation of Timberline Echoes and the CO. We knew we’d be giving up the trail made by the teams before, and the distance was about the same, but it looked like there would be fewer elevation changes, and it did turn out to be fairly level. Or at least we didn’t notice elevation changes. We also didn’t see the trail of the previous finder who was out a few weeks before us so they may have went straight to the swamp to the west, whereas we took the brushy straight-line (ha!) approach which may not have been the best choice.
From a difficulty level, not as bad as I expected, which was a pleasant surprise. I equate it to several other northwoods stomps I have done–high terrain is just part of the territory here. I was quite worried about my 8-year old son being able to make the trek but was assured it was doable, plus we saw the picture of the CO’s kids on the cache page which gave me some confidence. Basically, we put the adults in the front to break and pack the trail, and he brought up the rear. His only problem was falling from various holes and getting shoes hung up in the brush. On the way back, with the trail packed, it was smooth sailing. Exactly 2 hours start to finish, and that included taking breaks, discovering survey marks and “bearing trees” in the woods, and just generally enjoying the scenery.
Is this worthy of cache of the month? Someone asked me this question because, after all, it is just a box buried deep in the middle of nowhere, and there are plenty of boxes buried deep in the middle of nowhere. But what makes this particular box noteworthy is that it does take you somewhere in the middle of nowhere. It’s neat that someone found a topo map, noted “Eagle River source,” and decided to go find it, then decided to share that spot with others.
So if I think about what got us into geocaching in the first place, it was the opportunity to visit places and see things we would normally not, and to get some exercise and family time in the process. This cache offered all of that in abundance. It is a purist geocache–not snobby, but the type of geocache that you envision when you are asked by someone to describe what geocaching is all about. They might not understand the appeal, but you will when you get out here.
And I think that answers the question.
On the Left Side of the Road...Ok, I just didn’t know if it was a challenge cache or some personal objective. Answered!
On the Left Side of the Road...What is the point (seriously) of this endeavor? I see some Cache a Day challenges in Minnesota… 😕
On the Left Side of the Road...Interestingly, the DNR is giving UW-Green Bay an $18,000 grant to study the phenomenon of “thrill killing”–
http://www.fox11online.com/dpp/mobile/thrill-kill-study
It appears the DNR does have money somewhere. It will be interesting to see if they have the budget for the Get Outdoors and go Geocaching program.
On the Left Side of the Road...Well, that really is a “pet” peeve…
On the Left Side of the Road...@sandlanders wrote:
Send it to me, Cheezehead. I’ll take care of it for you. 😈
Heh heh…
I don’t think there’s a way to do this without hosting the image somewhere else and then including the link in the reviewer note. If the photobucket link doesn’t work, a good way of doing this is “burying” the image in the gallery of a long-archived cache of yours where people are unlikely to find it. You can always delete it from that cache gallery after the new cache is published.
I use this method a lot for posting pictures to the forums.
If that’s not clear…lemme know…
On the Left Side of the Road...@-cheeto- wrote:
The other thing I think is that like anything else in this game, quantity is not always a good thing.
It does kind of make me wonder whether, when you have an urban cemetery with caches shoehorned in a .1 mile grid, some people might look at that and say, “Talk about over kill!”
It’s interesting that this thread came up at this time because the other day we began looking at all our cemetery caches for potential archival. The criteria was, does this cache add something? Is it quality? Or is it just another micro cache? As a result I do expect we will be archiving quite a few in the near future.
On the other hand, there are several cemeteries in our “Shawano County Cemetery Challenge” series that would probably get very few visitors, or perhaps even no visitors, if it weren’t for geocachers. Some are abandoned and overgrown. One is a nearly forgotten potters field with one stone for hundreds of residents. One is in the middle of a cow pasture. Some are no more than marks on a plat map with the stones long gone.
That series was a long process of scouring plat maps and working with local genealogical groups and in some cases meeting the land owners. So if at least some of the cachers who do part or all of the series can experience that, it’s a good thing. So that series will remain active, even though there are a few urban cemeteries in it. (Well, if you count Shawano as urban…)
Regarding cemetery hides in general, we’ve always been comfortable trolling through graveyards due to a long interest in genealogy. However, some hides are questionable, and some caching practices have been downright disrespectful. Cemeteries are an area where the “game” aspect of geocaching should be deemphasized, in my opinion.
On the Left Side of the Road...@Todd300 wrote:
@gotta run wrote:
There I go griping again…
As always.
😕
Not me. You must have me confused with someone else. In fact I just got back from an awesome flight, and winter flying is always the best because the air is better. Plus it’s easier to see that nice black runway contrasted against the white snow. So it’s a great day to be alive. No compaints.
On the Left Side of the Road...@sandlanders wrote:
Wish all dog owners were as considerate and responsible.
Yes, I blame the owner, not the dogs. It is not the dog’s fault that it runs between my bike tires on a public roadway…knocks me down on a trail that requires a 6′ leash that the dog isn’t wearing…lays a big load in the middle of a park that doesn’t allow dogs that I step in…bites me after being assured by the owner that “he doesn’t bite.”…etc…
There I go griping again…
On the Left Side of the Road...@marc_54140 wrote:
Actually, I have found a dozen or more caches where the coordinates were not part of the puzzle solution. Seldom | Seen has some of these (Head Case, I’d Walk a Mile, etc) and so do Jimandlinda (go to the placque, read some numbers, go that direction….) and a few others around the state.
That is a good point to bring up. However, the S|S caches you mention do not really fit the template because coordinates can be derived from the information that is on the cache page, or at least that’s how we solved them. I know you prefer the wander-around method 😉 .
Obviously, field solve puzzles, whether it’s using field info to obtain coordinates, or going to a set of starting coordinates to obtain directions, both involve the GPSr as an “integral part of the hunt.”
And, I would equate taking someone to the final location of a field-solve to handing them coordiantes to a desk solve. For instance, our “WSQ A-Maze-ing,” there is no puzzle to solve for coordinates, it is just directions. But you could easily take the Puzzle Tour Bus to where the cache is rather than go through all the trouble of walking around, as long as one person on the bus knows where it is.
So, different details, same result, in my view.
On the Left Side of the Road...I apologize for anything I may have said to offend you. I have said things in these forums in frustration and in response to other comments, but as my father used to tell me, two wrongs don’t make a right. I’ve learned in the forums over the years that it’s easy for small deals to become big deals when they shouldn’t, particularly in a venue where it’s easy to misinterpret statements or assign meanings and subtleties that weren’t intended. So I have tried to temper my responses, albeit frequently unsuccessfully. I do not claim to be perfect or anywhere near it. So again, I apologize.
I started this poll because I have a genuine interest in how the community feels on this topic. If you don’t believe that, that is your choice. First of all, I feel the community could benefit from this knowledge. There are many people who won’t wade into a heated discussion on the topic, so I felt a poll that could be answered anonymously would be a good measure of the public temperature reading on the subject.
Also, personally I want to know this to determine how to address both existing and future cache placements, as well as to see how my views compare to the community as a whole. If I’m indeed in the small minority, maybe I should “just shut up” about it (as has been suggested more than once…) and accept the fact that puzzle caches have a short shelf life as things to be enjoyed as designed by the owners before they simply devolve into an unremarkable, de facto traditional hide.
Otherwise, I have a right to continue advocating my point of view, which is not to tell others how to play the game for themselves, but to cease in behavior that diminishes the game for others, not just those who place caches, but those who take pride in the puzzles they solve. It may be a quixotic endeavor.
On the Left Side of the Road... -
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